The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

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Greg_McNeish
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Greg_McNeish » Thu Jul 10, 2014 2:56 pm

Argentina's defence is why they're in the finals, but I don't see Germany being held to a clean sheet. They shut down Robben, and limited Sneijder's looks from outside, while Van Persie and the rest of the Dutch didn't seem at all interested in making the scorekeeper work. Throughout the tournament, they've neutralised the one or two scoring threats of the opposition, while waiting for Messi to work his magic (or for the shootout to arrive). Germany has more than one or two weapons, though. Müller always finds himself on the scoresheet, but the Germans have a lot of scoring depth, too. It's not JUST because the Portuguese in the first game, and the Brazilians in the last, were atrocious on defence that the scores were run up the way they were. Ozil and Kroos are capable of creating havoc, and old man Klose will definitely be headhunting in what he's already announced will be his last game with the German national team.

None of that is to say that goals will come easy, or that Argentina's defence won't be able to frustrate German attackers; I'm just saying that for Argentina to win, Messi will *HAVE* to make magic happen, at least once.
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by TheLyontamer » Thu Jul 10, 2014 3:25 pm

So you think there's absolutely no way Argentina keep a clean sheet, despite how easily they kept out Netherlands's potent attckers?

I'd also be remiss if I didn't point out that Özil has had a terrible tournament to go with his very poor last six months with Arsenal, and Klose hasn't exactly been on fire. I do wonder why Chlesea and Germany always leave Schürrle on the bench when he's such a stylish player and frequent goalscorer.

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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by GooberBM » Thu Jul 10, 2014 3:46 pm

The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence...

But nobody has kept a clean sheet on Germany yet. The important questions are this (a). Do Argentina have the athletes that can make Germany uncomfortable in the midfield like Ghana did and (b). Can the Argentine fullbacks and holding midifielders go over the top with long balls to spring the forwards the way each team has in the knockout rounds?

If they can do those things, Germany is at risk
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Greg_McNeish » Thu Jul 10, 2014 4:05 pm

Nothing's impossible, but Germany being kept off the scoreboard would shock me to my core, so yes, I'm saying that there's no way Argentina keeps the sheet clean.
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Red_And_Yellow » Thu Jul 10, 2014 4:54 pm

Argentina has conceded plenty of chances this tournament. Holland were just very ineffective this tournament when they weren't countering. They struggled to score against Mexico and Costa Rica. Both teams that sat back against them. Argentina was effective doing something similar.

The Germans are unlike any team the Argies have faced so far. With their attacking midfielders so astute and quick thinking in their movement and decision making, it poses a new problem. They'll need to provide Rojo help with Lahm overlapping.

They'll need Di Maria or Lavezzi to run at Hoewedes and cause that German back line trouble. Messi has tended to struggle in his career against teams with physical players. Germans will play Hummels, Khedira, Schweinsteiger and Boateng most likely. That's going to provide Messi trouble especially since he lacks the acceleration he used to following those muscle injuries.

I think it's the Germans to lose. 3-1 to the Germans. They are just too efficient.
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by TheLyontamer » Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:49 pm

Yeah, if I had to put money on one team, it would be Germany. I'm just trying to balance what's being said because in a World Cup final, it's hard to imagine anything but a close game, such is the pressure and tension. Same goes for the semis, but Germany didn't have an opportunity to get nervous against Brazil because they were 5-0 up in the blink of an eye.

Another thing to bear in mind is that, from everything I've read, winning the World Cup in Brazil would be the biggest coup in Argentina's footballing history. The rivalry between those two nations is absolutely immense. Many seem to think it would even surpass winning it in their own land in 1978. While that kind of pressure from supporters can make a team crumble to pieces (for exhibit A, see Brazil vs Germany on Tuesday), it can also inspire them to great things. Messi should be well past his best by 2018, so this could be Argentina's last chance to go all the way for a very long time. They hadn't been past the quarters since 1990. In a World Cup final, much more comes into the equation than simply the quality of the teams.

Let's not forget that most of Germany's players have plenty of experience of losing big semi-finals and finals (finalists in World Cup 2002 and Euro 2008; semi-finalists in World Cup 2006 and 2010, as well as Euro 2012). Getting to the last four of every biennial tournament of the last twelve years except Euro 2004 but never winning is just incredible. It almost sounds impossible. There's no way that won't be weighing very heavily on the minds of all the players. Brazil rolled over under a smidgen of pressure in the last game. I highly doubt Argentina will. It's time to see what the Germans are made of psychologically in their quest to finally take the last step.

I also expect Germany to score, but remember that they failed to find the back of the net in ninety minutes against Algeria.

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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Red_And_Yellow » Fri Jul 11, 2014 8:24 am

With ze Germans, you also omitted the recent CL troubles that Bayern have had and a large number of that squad has been in the CL and only won it once in the last five years despite advancing to the final 3 times and the semifinal 4.

Now, I don't necessarily think I'd call them chokers. Chokers don't win in Brazil against Brazil by 6 goals but their squads just weren't peaking at the right time in those other tournaments. Ballack carried an otherwise overmatched Germany to the WC Semis in 2006, where they lost to eventual champion Italy. The German team was full of talent but just too young for WC 2010 and they ended up losing to the eventual champion Spain.

Euro 2012 was a weird one but it seems like this team has finally come together and is peaking at the right time.
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by TheLyontamer » Fri Jul 11, 2014 5:05 pm

The semi-final from the point of view of the Germans:


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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by eobversion1 » Sat Jul 12, 2014 3:35 pm

The big night is almost upon us.....GO NORTH KOREA!!!

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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by TheLyontamer » Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:20 pm

Brazil have come out today meaning business and looking very ambitious. They're clearly trying to go one better than they did in the last game by conceding eight goals. That's the kind of determination I like to see.

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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by GooberBM » Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:41 pm

I'm not sure you can leave out the ref, who blew two parts of that call on the penalty, and missed the offside that led to the second goal.

Now that Brazil actually has settled down, it'd be nice if the ref hadn't helped dig the hole they're in
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by TheLyontamer » Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:47 pm

The penalty was unfortunate alright. I think the offside was very debatable. I'd have no problem allowing it to slide.

The ref really is having a shocker on both sides. He's been missing all kinds of stuff, and giving totally wrong decisions.

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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Greg_McNeish » Sat Jul 12, 2014 5:00 pm

GooberBM wrote:I'm not sure you can leave out the ref, who blew two parts of that call on the penalty
Two parts? It happened outside the box as one. What's the other?
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by GooberBM » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:12 pm

Greg_McNeish wrote:
GooberBM wrote:I'm not sure you can leave out the ref, who blew two parts of that call on the penalty
Two parts? It happened outside the box as one. What's the other?
Yellow card instead of a red
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Greg_McNeish » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:24 pm

Oh, right. Yeah, that too.

This sure was a shitty week for Brazilian football. Conceded 10 goals in their last two matches of their own World Cup. Ouch.
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Legend_Killer » Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:43 pm

What a pointless game the 3rd and 4th playoff is.
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by GooberBM » Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:50 pm

#ExtraRevenue
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Greg_McNeish » Sat Jul 12, 2014 9:00 pm

How often has the Golden Boot winner played in the 3/4 playoff? Seems like prime territory to run up a player's goal tally, in a meaningless game.
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by Legend_Killer » Sat Jul 12, 2014 9:01 pm

I am not a fan of the Brazilian team but I felt really bad for them this morning. To expect them to get up for a game after the beating the Germans gave them is harsh.
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Re: The 20th FIFA World Cup Thread

Post by TheLyontamer » Sat Jul 12, 2014 9:09 pm

It's not very meaningful, but both teams had a lot of pride to play for and gave a good account of themselves. I don't think there were too many easy goals on offer. Well, unless David Luiz was involved.

I'd be even more interested in finding out how many times the Golden Boot winner has been eliminated in the quarter-final. Unless Müller or Messi do something about it tomorrow night, that's exactly what will end up happening in this tournament, and would be quite remarkable.

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